West ignorant of what N. Korea really wants: expert

Pusan National University political science professor Robert Kelly, right, speaks during a session of the Korea Times Forum at the Korea Chamber of Commerce and Industry in Seoul, Wednesday. At left is Soo Kim, a policy analyst at the RAND Corporation who moderated the session. Korea Times photo by Shim Hyun-chul

North Korea wants normalization of diplomatic relations with West without giving up nuclear weapons: Joseph DeTrani

By Kang Seung-woo

Along with massive economic assistance, the normalization of diplomatic relations with the West ― particularly with the United States ― has long been viewed by countries outside of North Korea as one of the carrots that could persuade the reclusive state from seeking nuclear weapons.

But a former U.S. diplomat said that North Korea has no intention to get rid of its nuclear weapons in exchange for economic incentives or the normalization of diplomatic relations. Joe DeTrani said the reclusive state wants both: to normalize diplomatic relations with the West while keeping its nuclear arsenal intact.

"The North Koreans have been telling us, and certainly they've been telling me from 2003 to 2016, when I've been meeting them officially or track 1.5 meetings with a deputy foreign minister, that North Korea wants to be accepted as a nuclear weapons state and they want normal relations with the United States ― they want both," DeTrani, a former U.S. special envoy for negotiations with North Korea, said during a session of the Korea Times Forum on the theme "New Challenges for Korea-U.S. Alliance," at the Korea Chamber of Commerce and Industry in Seoul, Wednesday. DeTrani, now in Albuquerque, New Mexico, joined the discussion remotely.

According to the former ambassador, North Korea wants to be accepted as a nuclear state like Pakistan, while also stressing that the North has claimed its nuclear program is intended as a deterrent and will not be used offensively.

"We've told them, 'No accepting you as a nuclear weapon state.' It's going to lend itself to a nuclear arms race in the region," DeTrani said, expressing concerns over the possibility of nuclear proliferation or fissile material getting into the hands of a rogue state or a non-state terrorist.

Wi Sung-lac, right, South Korea's former chief nuclear envoy to the six-party talks, and Joseph DeTrani, the U.S.' former special envoy to the six-party talks, participate remotely in a session of the Korea Times Forum at the Korea Chamber of Commerce and Industry in Seoul, Wednesday. Korea Times photo by Shim Hyun-chul

"For those reasons, we're talking about complete, verifiable denuclearization in return for what you want," DeTrani continued.

Stressing that it took two and a half years for the six-party talks to come up with a joint statement, he added, "We have to be patient."

As North Korea has been advancing its nuclear program rapidly, skepticism is arising over whether denuclearizing Pyongyang is a realistic goal.

Since 2006, North Korea has conducted a total of six nuclear tests and a seventh is believed to be just around the corner, triggering much talk about accepting it as a legitimate nuclear weapons state. The totalitarian regime has sought to win the recognition from the United States in what appears to be a move to get international sanctions against it lifted.

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Due to the long history of failures to get North Korea to abandon its nuclear program, some argue that the international community should pursue a more attainable goal of curbing the country's nuclear development and avoiding the use of its existing weapons, in the form of an arms control agreement.

Robert Kelly, a professor of political science at Pusan National University, said it will not be easy to convince North Korea to abandon its nuclear program, citing the lack of options for Seoul.

"It's just not really clear what our other choices are. Negotiations are the best way. And I still think that there is that pathway of small deals that build upward, but it doesn't look like the North Koreans actually want to go the whole way in and denuclearize," Kelly said.

Soo Kim, a policy analyst at the RAND Corporation, speaks during a session of the Korea Times Forum at the Korea Chamber of Commerce and Industry in Seoul, Wednesday. Korea Times photo by Shim Hyun-chul

"So we might get some constraints, maybe we'll get some inspectors to get the North Koreans to cap it at like 200 strategic missiles and warheads or something like that, but they're never going to go to zero," he said. "We could always just sort of accept it. Again, our options are just really poor."

Soo Kim, a policy analyst at the RAND Corporation who moderated the session, also said the U.S. as well as South Korea are running out of options when it comes to North Korea.

"So among the Korea watcher community, we call North Korea the land of lousy options, because there just aren't that many creative ideas to bring North Korea back to the negotiating table, and to actually convince Kim Jong-un to give up some aspect of its nuclear program," she said.

China is North Korea's ally and can exert influence on the Kim regime, so some panelists insisted on reaching out to Beijing to resume negotiations which has been deadlocked since February 2019 when the U.S. and North Korea failed to reach a nuclear deal in Hanoi, Vietnam.

"Even though it's an extremely difficult suggestion, I would argue that Washington and Beijing and Seoul should try to carve out the Korean Peninsula-related issues ― particularly the negotiation on peace and stability issues," Wi Sung-lac, South Korea's former chief nuclear envoy to the six-party talks, said.

"From the context of general competition rivalry between Washington and Beijing, if that is made possible, we can expand the space of cooperation."

North Korea's cryptocurrency-related cyberattacks have been coming to the fore, as the country has been seeking to secure illegal funds for its nuclear weapons programs through cryptocurrency theft. According to a U.N. Security Council report released in April, the North is suspected of stealing as much as $400 million worth of cryptocurrency in 2021.

"I'm suggesting that we have to think about an international regime for like-minded countries to control these new and really serious illicit activities," Wi said, adding that a good example is the Proliferation Security Initiative (PSI). The PSI is aimed at stopping the trafficking of weapons of mass destruction (WMDs), their delivery systems and related materials to and from states and non-state actors of proliferation concern.

"The PSI was initially started by the Bush administration, and was quite effective. So something like the PSI regime is required. I think now is the time to consider to deal with new illicit activities coming from Pyongyang," he said.